Vision Quests for People Who Mean Business

Just walk me through, like, exactly what it looks like, where people go, what they do, what they bring with them, like, get into brass tacks here. And again, it can go a lot of different ways. Anyways, a fantastic library of books over there and you can go to tryaudiobooks. This podcast is also brought to you by Organifi.

Organifi makes these juices, they have a red juice; they have a green juice; they have a gold juice and rather than you needing to go out and purchase a bunch of vegetables, and beets, and berries, and turmeric, and everything else, and chop, and cut, and clean, and blend, and make a big mess in your kitchen, you just take one simple clean, elegant scoop of this stuff. You drop it into your blender or into a cup of water, give it a shake, give it a stir, give it a blend. My kids make themselves red smoothies now with the Organifi red juice before they go to school.

They even do a nighttime golden juice blend made from turmeric and coconut milk , cinnamon, ginger, lemon balm, and reishi for you to cuddle up with for a good night of sleep. Very simple, you go to Organifi. How did they find that quite place in nature and what do they have with them? So, that starts with the physical aspect. On the one of the spectrum, if you went out there in an RV or if you went out there with fancy tents and knives and all this gear… or even primitively, if you had a big, fancy primitive shelter that you spend days working on that really insulates you.

You have probably experience this, others probably have when we walk in nature certain places call to us. Well, I mean, it could be a variety of different places in terms of the specific land, sure. Sometimes we run programs on private property, but it could also be wilderness area, maybe BLM or National Forest or whatnot. Yeah, so like, public land, that type of thing. So what we do is, we might have a little marker circle of rocks, you know, a distance away, and then every morning at dawn, the person comes out and puts a unique… makes a shift in the rocks in such a way that I know that that was done by them.

You know, we have a pre-agreement ahead of time. How many days does someone typically embarking on a rite of passage in a situation like that? I like to give people just the pure experience. But that was a reasonable challenge because what did I learn there? I learned to get comfortable just on my own outside of nature. I learned what it was to quiet my mind. I got to know my place and that was all preparation for the bigger rite of passage, the bigger vision quest. And then what did your rite of passage look like?

Well, when I did mine, it was 4-days in the Pine Barrens of New Jersey and it was just a small circle. Some people are comfortable with prayer, others not so much. I had my second vision quest — thousand pound bull moose come down feet from me… well, Scared the hell out of me, I was in that state I was sure it was coming to kill me, you know. And maybe, symbolically it was. Maybe it was coming and killing the young man so that the man could be born.

Tell me that story.

Delve into this moose story because this occurred during a rite of passage, right? So, on my second vision quest, this would have been, oh gosh, I was in the green mountains of Vermont where I was studying in a wilderness school. So, I decided I was going to go off on one by myself, which I definitely do not recommend for people. And that can be challenging.

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Those things are huge, right! But, sometimes, you have to face that. Part of the rite of passage, sometimes, and growing up is facing your fears, right? So here I am, facing my fear. So, getting close to mating season, but not quite there. Do I run away? I was really in the midst spell of that fear, right? And so, eventually, the moose stands up and goes on its way not towards me and of course I was fine. So, I struggled and then what did I wind up doing? I wind up seeking out a guide after the fact to help me process my experience. And he was helpful, you know. Luckily, I was able to find someone pretty quick, but I really needed that.

So, that was part one and years later, which is actually just a couple years ago, I found myself here in Idaho not feeling the full fulfillment from my work at Twin Eagles that I once had. And so, I could sense a new phase was coming, so I went on another vision quest and this time up to a place called Hunt Lake out south of [ And I picked one that was huge and kind of positioned where it was flat on top and underneath there was a cave.

And, I used that as my spot- again, a four day process. There was a big enough opening in there and I could stay dry. So, it was like a little cave. So, I had just a little 8 x 10 tarp and I made, before I realized that the cave was there… I made this little shelter for myself and it rained all night on me. And, I had limited water, I was going on a quart a day I think, which is pretty low, right? Recommended is like a gallon a day and so, it was about a quarter of what I should have been at normally.

In the dream, what I find is this big giant moose and it was white and glowing, right. And, it was like the spirit of the moose!

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And it was that same moose that I had seen, physically, in that vision quest years prior. And there was this whole moment of connection in the dream and I processed that later with my guide. And for me, what that was representing was the completion of something. Like, moose was an animal that, you know, I was walking with, you could say, during those years, spiritually speaking. With the medicine of moose, it helped me start the school and there was a real connection there.

And it was like I graduated the moose years, kind of, right, to kind of use that modern term. So, is a moose like your spirit animal? Well, at that point, I really connected with that. I have such a reverence for all of this, Ben, and for the natural world. What about for a boy doing a rite of passage? How would that be different from that a man doing a rite of passage?

Are the boys typically paired up with other young men? Are they off by themselves? What does it mean to be a young man? What does it mean to be an adolescent? So, where they get to just be on their own with wild nature, with spirit, with God, you know, however you want to phrase that. And in that time, like when I took my boys through this, I gave them a rite of competence, and it was a literally, like, they spent an hour and a half sitting in the tepee in the woods. And so, it was this micro-solo- this micro vision quest.

But the point, even in that, was kind of the same, like, okay, spend time just with yourself and be brave, you know, and just have that time to yourself and of course the whole community was there holding the space before and after. And so, simply put, as men, are we aware of our feelings, our emotions, and are we accepting of them in ourselves and are we expressing them? Right, this is basic emotional intelligence. You can either be a machismo kind of bully or you can be the wimp and just collapse. What does it mean to stand up, feel my feelings, express them, speak my truth powerfully, but not use my power to hurt others?

I know my truth. I know who I am. I stand up for that.

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I ask for what I want. And if so, how does that look and what happens then? They were six when I first met them I think? So, I will have known them at that point for what is that, six, seven years. Of course you and Jessa are watching them grow. And what starts happening? Puberty starts kicking in. They start getting less… less interested in all the family routines and the stuff happening in the home and they start individuating, right. They need to separate socially, to some extent, from the parents and family and move in to a greater social scene.

These are all the classic signs. There would be a conversation between you and I and Jessa. You know, I always send a calling letter to the boys. Adolescence is going to happen. Adulthood is going to happen. So, what are we doing to prepare for it? And do I have the same philosophy.

But the way I see it: We might 6… 4 to 10, 4 to 12 boys grouped together. And again, that would be the same for an adult one. We have to deal. A person is then facing some challenges that are unknown. The old school traditional way [1: Why do you call it Purpose Mountain? Yeah, so Purpose Mountain is my new business and it actually just started in the past year here. But, there is a journey that we must take to get there. Yes, they meet a deep developmental need. Yes, they address the needs of the psyche. There is still a lot more needed.

I want everyone in the world to be on track and be successful, but most people out there are struggling. Got to step up. And that was a good thing back then. That was a strategy that worked. It got me here. So the answer is not to demonize that and to beat ourselves up for these sides of ourselves. So, here we are at 30, years old still with the same survival strategies that can appear to be holding us back. You need to take care of your physical self, but not to the extent of being really comfy! The idea is to meet your spiritual self, the spirits, the Creator, God, whatever-you-call-it, in as simple a way as possible, unencumbered, with as little between you and the spiritual realm as possible.

Take appropriate clothing into the Quest with you, unless you intend to do a more austere Quest, in which you meet Nature on its own terms with an absolute minimum of protection. This is a valid approach, but you should be up to it, and prepare for it, on all levels: Therefore, you may wish to take a light sleeping bag to wrap yourself in at night-time. If it's autumn, maybe bring something waterproof in case it rains being wet when it's cooler out may cause hypothermia.

It's up to you - exercise common sense. Generally speaking, the more austere the Quest, the more intense it will be. The more comfy you are, the less intense it will be. But overall, you don't want to put yourself in any danger. If you need to take in food or medication, ensure that it is in sealed containers. You don't need the distraction of animals being attracted to that stuff. When you select your spot also consider what you will do with your human wastes. If you fast and drink a reduced amount of water, there won't be any, of course.

But there may still be some in the first day or two. Some people prefer to Quest with a helper or protector overseeing their Quest. Some even go so far as to pay someone to do this, or they pay to "go on" or "do" or "take" a Vision Quest somewhere. Others prefer to do the entire Quest alone, from start through finish.

There are arguments for and against each alternative. What you do is your choice. They can be a spiritual helper, who guides you through the entire process, from preparations, to watching over you during your Quest, to afterwards helping you understand what you received during the Quest. Or you may wish to have a helper who fills only a more physical role, watching over you during the Quest to ensure you're physically okay, and that no one disturbs you. And perhaps helping to get you back to the regular world afterwards. For example, it is possible that you may not be in any shape to drive immediately after the Quest.

On the other hand, a "helper" may in fact turn out to be a detriment to your quest, if the "help" that they offer in fact turns out to be a hindrance or a distraction. On the spiritual level, a helper can interfere if they introduce energies to your Quest, even if simply just by their presence. Or if they "protect" you by shielding you from influences that in fact need to be part of your Quest. This is the argument for doing the whole thing completely alone from start to finish - what happens to you will be of your own doing, and will be meant for you alone.

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If you decide to have a helper of any type, be sure that it is someone that you trust completely. Your well-being may be completely in their hands. This is especially true if they are helping you in a spiritual role. Paying a stranger to be your helper is something to be very careful of.

Also, it is important to select someone who will not "bring you down" when you come out. For example, if you are a quiet, introspective person, you should probably not select someone who is loud and boisterous. You will likely be wanting time for reflection after the Quest, and they could easily intrude into that.

Another example, if you select someone who is into psychology, and this is not at all your view, then don't utilize that person.

[Transcript] – How To Go On A Vision Quest & Embark Upon A Rite Of Passage.

And be careful of getting "slotted" into a particular way of going into, doing, and coming out of the quest. Please note that in any traditional setting, there is no fee charged. In fact, in most traditional circles of any flavour it is regarded as very wrong to charge for any spiritual teachings or activities. Rather, one offers what one is able to, in recognition that those who are helping and guiding you have to live ie, they have to eat and have somewhere to live just as you do. And while they are doing this for you, they aren't working for that time period. And a package of tobacco - if you feel you must make a gift of that in the Native tradition - isn't enough!!

In many traditions, the Quest begins at sunrise. You are, of course, free to choose what time of day to start, and what time of day on the last day to finish. Again, all aspects of the Quest should be done in a way that feels right to you.

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But sunrise is symbolic in that it is a beginning. On the other hand, it might be symbolic to you to start the Quest at sunset, to symbolize the ending of the "old you". And to end it at sunrise, to symbolize the emergence of the "new you". When you reach your Quest area, draw a circle, or otherwise delineate an area that will become your Quest area. Once you step into that area, do not leave it for the duration of the Quest. The purpose of this is to provide some discipline to your Quest, so that you will be less easily distracted or thrown off your Quest. A Vision Quest is all about facing yourself, and learning about yourself and your path in life.

The circle boundary helps to ensure that you stay focused. Otherwise you might be tempted to go for a walk to have a look around! There's not a lot to say about "what to do" during the Quest. Generally speaking, the idea is face yourself with as little distraction as possible. And to listen to what the spiritual realms have to offer you. Essentially it's a time of listening. In most traditions, the Quester tries to stay awake at all times. This may or may not be possible or practical for you. Some say that what you need to receive will come to you whether you are conscious or not.

Others will say that you need to be conscious to understand and retain what is given to you, and that it shows discipline. You are not there to "prove" anything. You don't need to "prove" you are "worthy" to the spiritual realm, or to God. Any spiritual being worth paying attention to already knows what's in your heart, and where you are at spiritually. Nor do you have to prove anything to any person. This is all about YOU. If it's the right time for you, and you make yourself ready, and conduct yourself in an appropriate manner, then whatever you need will come to you.

What's an "appropriate manner"? A Quest is a serious thing. Approach it with reverence and anticipation but not expectations! On the physical level, if you find yourself in trouble physically, then don't hesitate to bail out if you need to. It's not the right time to be doing a Quest if you are endangering yourself by doing it. You haven't "failed" if you leave early.

A Quest is all about finding your way in life; it's not about debilitating yourself! Nor is it about "proving" anything, to anyone. During the Quest many insights will come to you that may help you in your life, in your relationships, in healing yourself, and so on. You may receive insights and guidance on what to do with your life, where to go, and why. The meaning of some things may become clear.

It's very important to be watchful for these things. Please remember that they can come to you in many different ways. Again, the key word here is to listen. The word "listen" encompasses much more than mere physical listening with your ears. It's a state of watchfulness for signs and insights that are meant for you, that can help you, that point things out to you, that guide you. Listen to what is being offered to you. That's why you are doing the Quest, after all! And some things which come to you won't make sense until a later date.

A question which you should be asking right about now is, "What if the things I receive are merely delusions brought about by lack of food and water? Try to reach a sense of what feels right and correct to you. Look at what comes to you from a state of balanced objectivity, as much as possible.

This doesn't mean to use your logical mind to analyze what you receive, however. Filter it through your sense of what feels right, using your intuition and common sense. Some people recommend "journaling" during your Quest. If you don't know what that means, it simply refers to writing down what comes to you, what happens to you, etc. For some this may be appropriate.

For others it can become a big distraction. Spiritual things are understood on a level much deeper than the logical thinking mind. The activity of putting what comes to you into words engages that logical mind and can easily drag you out of a deeper state. If you are thinking of writing in a journal during your Quest, consider this carefully.

Your Quest may turn into merely a time of writing random thoughts that come through your mind! For some a compromise might be to keep the journal closed, opening it only when some major insight comes to you. Some say that you will remember and understand what you need to remember and understand, without having to write it down.

And within the context of North American Native traditions, writing is generally frowned upon, even forbidden, during spiritual activities. Plan ahead so that you aren't plunged back into society and your day-to-day life immediately afterwards. You will need and want some time alone to reflect on your experience, on what you received during the Quest. How long depends on you.

I would suggest a couple of days at a minimum. Similar to the period prior to the Quest, don't go around telling everyone about your Quest. It's no one's business except your own. If you find yourself telling everyone, "I went on a Vision Quest", then take a good look at yourself, as your ego is likely being overactive.

A Quest is an intensely private affair and is no one's business but your own. If insights have come to you about changes you need to make in your life, try your hardest to make the changes. To ignore them, and to not make any effort to implement the changes, is disrespectful of the whole process.

If you subsequently Quest again, you likely won't receive very much more than what you received on the previous Vision Quest until you start to live what has already been given to you. That's generally how spiritual things work.

W. E. Boden (Author of Vision Quests for People Who Mean Business)

You will receive a certain amount of guidance, help, insight, etc. As well, if you find yourself in a spiritually "dry" phase in life, it may be that you need to go back and re-examine what you've been given so far, and work on these "old" things first, before you can progress further. Nowadays many people recommend utilizing "journaling" there's that word again as a means to expand on and understand what you received during your Quest. Some even encourage you to sing about it, dance it out, and so on. You don't feel like dancing or writing?

Traditionally, a person's Vision Quest was a very private affair, and nothing was even written down. As an alternative, you can take the point of view that anything that you need to remember, you will remember. Do what works for YOU. The real expression of what has come to you in your Quest is to start living it. Seek to understand what has come to you, what has been given to you, and make changes in your life. Seek to integrate it into your life. Again, as I said above, spiritual things are understood on a level much deeper than the logical thinking mind.

Be careful of this. If you are led to write about what you received, it is usually best to do so after the Quest.